[Baddceo]

Who designs a vehicle that requires the entire hub and bearing to be removed (bearing has to be replaced when it's removed) in order to replace a stud? This is the most asinine design I have ever seen. I don't mind paying the $2.50 for a new stud but the **** with you Honda for sticking the customer with $597.50 because you couldn't figure out a better way to handle the situation.

The response I get from Honda. Well studs don't just break unless they are over torqued. So that gives you an excuse to lock them into a position they can't be easily replaced from. It's human error and we can't warranty for that. So if I go over drive the car and break something that's "mechanical" it's get replaced under warranty because it's mechanical. Who's to say the lug was not over torqued at the factory or sometime between delivery to the store and then to me. Car only has 4,000 miles on it and the wheels have never been taken off until they got replaced but it's immediately my fault because it couldn't be anyone else's. For the record the custom wheel shop is where it happened but I watched them through the entire process and not once did an impact wrench touch those wheels. Everything was hand tightened and then torque wrenched to spec. If not the hubs warp, happens to me all time when Honda just slams a rim on the car and drives the lugs down.

I've immediately reached out to the Regional Director for Honda Dealers here in KC and I will file a formal complaint with Honda of America if that goes no where. He was on board with my initial appeal but fell back on it's the shops fault and the cost of doing business, which I get. It's just a lame excuse to screw the customer and frankly I am not really in the mood to be paying for someone's brilliant idea of saving a buck in production.

What's even more unfortunate is I really like my 2.0T sport quite a bit and now with my new shoes even more, but this has really left a bad taste over everything.

Ok I feel better now, thanks for listening

 

[rubberpantz]

Sorry about your troubles; that sucks! What wheels are those? They're dope AF.

 

[Baddceo]

Thank you. Those are Vossen VFS1 staggered.

 

[Fired00d]

Sucks this happened and the design is very customer unfriendly from a financial standpoint. However... not surprised at Honda's position since this didn't happen at a dealership and it happened during the installation of aftermarket wheels. Sorry to say but from a business standpoint their (Honda's) liability was released when you went this route. If this happened during the removal of OEM wheels or installation of the aftermarket wheels why didn't the place you purchased/had them installed cover the repair... IMO that would've been good customer service on their part.

 

[icspots]

Sucks this happened and the design is very customer unfriendly from a financial standpoint. However... not surprised at Honda's position since this didn't happen at a dealership and it happened during the installation of aftermarket wheels. Sorry to say but from a business standpoint their (Honda's) liability was released when you went this route. If this happened during the removal of OEM wheels or installation of the aftermarket wheels why didn't the place you purchased/had them installed cover the repair... IMO that would've been good customer service on their part.

this. I’d chat with your installers about the repair. Or given they’re an actual shop perhaps they’d do the repair themselves, that way they eat part of the cost vs charging high labor rates.

 

[PhilipS]

Wheel installer's responsibility. Sorry about your bad day.

Attached are the front and rear brake diagrams. Rear diagram has the caliper mounted on the rear. Through the splash shield where the caliper rests, I can see one spot that a seasoned tech could R&R the studs without removing everything else. When someone is under there please let us know.

 

[jonda]

Shows to go ya ..new cars are not ment to be touched ...

 

[Rick Grahn]

This doesn't help but my subaru wheel hubs were made the same way. It cost me several hundred dollars.

 

[alorentzen]

Who designs a vehicle that requires the entire hub and bearing to be removed (bearing has to be replaced when it's removed) in order to replace a stud? This is the most asinine design I have ever seen. I don't mind paying the $2.50 for a new stud but the **** with you Honda for sticking the customer with $597.50 because you couldn't figure out a better way to handle the situation.
.....snip.....
Ok I feel better now, thanks for listening

Did you ever find a workaround for this or did you have to do the full hub and bearing deal? I have the same problem with Honda saying more like $700 than $600!

 

[True_North_Accord]

So I'm having the same problem with my dad's 2020 Accord 1.5T Sport.

He purchased the car last summer. We had the winter tires installed on aftermarket wheels at a local tire shop back in November. I went to put the OEM wheels back on using the OEM studs and after the hand tightening part, I went to tighten them with the torque wrench and it kept tightening up, and eventually I heard the snap. I have the torque wrench set to 95 ft/lbs and have never had an issue like this before.

Issue happened on both front wheels. Also note, the locking nut torqued properly, but the other 4 were experiencing this same issue. I've been swapping winter wheels on multiple cars for 15 years now and have never experienced this issue before. In fact I do my family's cars (7 cars per season).

I recalled this thread and decided I don't want to pay to have the entire hubs taken off, especially having to get two of them done, so I'll be grinding the sides to get the bolt on and off. Asking on a couple of FB groups, it seems others have experienced changing the lug studs already too. Which is strange considering these cars are less than 4 years old. It appears to be a common issue on these accords.

This is has left a bad taste in my mouth as well and I also don't know if after replacing the studs, I'll still have the issue with torquing the bolts...

 

[Keyboard]

@Baddceo, The dealer was right. Studs don't break unless over torqued. The custom wheel shop probably over torqued your lug nuts. That's not Honda's fault, so they aren't going to cover the repairs for another shop's mistake.

The Accord's lug nuts are to be tightened at 80 ft. lbs on OEM studs.

@True_North_Accord, the lugs broke because you tightened to 95 ft. lbs.

 

[True_North_Accord]

@Baddceo, The dealer was right. Studs don't break unless over torqued. The custom wheel shop probably over torqued your lug nuts. That's not Honda's fault, so they aren't going to cover the repairs for another shop's mistake.

The Accord's lug nuts are to be tightened at 80 ft. lbs on OEM studs.

@True_North_Accord, the lugs broke because you tightened to 95 ft. lbs.

Thanks for the info! I thought most cars were in the 82-85 ft/lbs range but find over the winter months they loosen up. Hence torquing them slightly higher.

I feel like the actual issue is possibly related to the quality of the studs or lug nuts being used. They kept spinning, fairly effortlessly and not even reaching 95. As if the threads were soft and giving in.

 

[icspots]

Thanks for the info! I thought most cars were in the 82-85 ft/lbs range but find over the winter months they loosen up. Hence torquing them slightly higher.

I feel like the actual issue is possibly related to the quality of the studs or lug nuts being used. They kept spinning, fairly effortlessly and not even reaching 95. As if the threads were soft and giving in.

If they‘re loosening up when torqued properly then possibly just … I dunno…. Just tighten them back up. Overtorquing them can absolutely lead to the stud failing.

We all agree the design leaves a little be desired. Whether or not it’s a normal wear item studs can and do fail. I’ve had one snap when loosening with a hand lug wrench because the threads were corroded. Another time I had a lug nut get cross threaded while going on by hand. **** happens, and not accounting for that in the design is annoying, especially when many engineers include a notch somewhere being the hub for a stud to be knocked out.

 

[True_North_Accord]

If they‘re loosening up when torqued properly then possibly just … I dunno…. Just tighten them back up. Overtorquing them can absolutely lead to the stud failing.

We all agree the design leaves a little be desired. Whether or not it’s a normal wear item studs can and do fail. I’ve had one snap when loosening with a hand lug wrench because the threads were corroded. Another time I had a lug nut get cross threaded while going on by hand. **** happens, and not accounting for that in the design is annoying, especially when many engineers include a notch somewhere being the hub for a stud to be knocked out.

I completely agree with you on the over torquing and the annoying design.

One thing I don't think I mentioned above, for my situation. The locking lug tightened properly, it was the regular (non-locking) ones that gave me issues, all 8 on the front wheels (4 per side).

 

[True_North_Accord]

@Baddceo, The dealer was right. Studs don't break unless over torqued. The custom wheel shop probably over torqued your lug nuts. That's not Honda's fault, so they aren't going to cover the repairs for another shop's mistake.

The Accord's lug nuts are to be tightened at 80 ft. lbs on OEM studs.

@True_North_Accord, the lugs broke because you tightened to 95 ft. lbs.

If they‘re loosening up when torqued properly then possibly just … I dunno…. Just tighten them back up. Overtorquing them can absolutely lead to the stud failing.

We all agree the design leaves a little be desired. Whether or not it’s a normal wear item studs can and do fail. I’ve had one snap when loosening with a hand lug wrench because the threads were corroded. Another time I had a lug nut get cross threaded while going on by hand. **** happens, and not accounting for that in the design is annoying, especially when many engineers include a notch somewhere being the hub for a stud to be knocked out.

Update: I was able to replace the broken stud. As you guys mentioned, I had overtorqued them and caused them to stretch then break. There was a second stud that had been stretched and was nearing a point of breaking so I replaced that one as well. I torqued everything to 82lbs/ft and it tightened up properly.

Thanks for all your help!

 

[icspots]

Update: I was able to replace the broken stud. As you guys mentioned, I had overtorqued them and caused them to stretch then break. There was a second stud that had been stretched and was nearing a point of breaking so I replaced that one as well. I torqued everything to 82lbs/ft and it tightened up properly.

Thanks for all your help!

How exactly did you go about replacing them? Just grinding down the side of the stud, or did you have to modify anything else?

 

[True_North_Accord]

How exactly did you go about replacing them? Just grinding down the side of the stud, or did you have to modify anything else?

Ground down a groove on the Hub to make space for the stud to come in and out of. The groove has to be big enough to clear the bolt head.

Also, have to make sure the studs come straight in and out and not on an angle, or the new bolt's threads will get ruined.

 

[lmmoore400]

View attachment 4648 View attachment 4649 Who designs a vehicle that requires the entire hub and bearing to be removed (bearing has to be replaced when it's removed) in order to replace a stud? This is the most asinine design I have ever seen. I don't mind paying the $2.50 for a new stud but the **** with you Honda for sticking the customer with $597.50 because you couldn't figure out a better way to handle the situation. The response I get from Honda. Well studs don't just break unless they are over torqued. So that gives you an excuse to lock them into a position they can't be easily replaced from. It's human error and we can't warranty for that. So if I go over drive the car and break something that's "mechanical" it's get replaced under warranty because it's mechanical. Who's to say the lug was not over torqued at the factory or sometime between delivery to the store and then to me. Car only has 4,000 miles on it and the wheels have never been taken off until they got replaced but it's immediately my fault because it couldn't be anyone else's. For the record the custom wheel shop is where it happened but I watched them through the entire process and not once did an impact wrench touch those wheels. Everything was hand tightened and then torque wrenched to spec. If not the hubs warp, happens to me all time when Honda just slams a rim on the car and drives the lugs down. I've immediately reached out to the Regional Director for Honda Dealers here in KC and I will file a formal complaint with Honda of America if that goes no where. He was on board with my initial appeal but fell back on it's the shops fault and the cost of doing business, which I get. It's just a lame excuse to screw the customer and frankly I am not really in the mood to be paying for someone's brilliant idea of saving a buck in production. What's even more unfortunate is I really like my 2.0T sport quite a bit and now with my new shoes even more, but this has really left a bad taste over everything. Ok I feel better now, thanks for listening

I just payed less then $5 for a stud and lug. They got me for $ 390.98 labor!!!! That's some BS!!!